Chris Do

00:00:00.080 - 00:00:15.060

I think in a society where we're trained to prize answers, questions are the undervalued thing that if you learn how to ask great questions, especially in this age of AI, to bring it full circle, it's the big unlock in life.

Sean Cannell

00:00:28.640 - 00:02:02.322

All right, welcome back to the Think Media podcast. I'm here with Chris Do. 2.3 million subscribers, over 250 million views on your YouTube channel, the Future.

You are the CEO, Director, Emmy Award winning designer and chief strategist, founder of the future mission of teaching 1 billion people how to make a living doing what they love. So you're definitely an expert and a futurist.

And so we're going to be talking about AI, we're going to be talking about the creator economy, tips for YouTube creators as a content creator, yourself brand, and some tactical things that people can apply to build their brands, make more money, build their personal brands. But let's start with AI. So AI is disrupting a lot, you know that. But there's a few things I looked up.

So a Goldman Sachs report found that 300 million jobs globally could be disrupted by AI technology. Banks are fighting over AI talent and looking to hire AI experts.

And there was one CEO who actually shared on Twitter that he replaced 90% of his support staff with an AI chat bot, saying that copy and paste jobs are gone. And then chatgpt. Check out this stat. Last year recorded 39% of the US workforce did freelance work. You're an expert in that per upwork.

But that chat GPT is already stealing work from freelancers, especially those that are writing. So AI good, bad and ugly, what do you think?

Chris Do

00:02:02.426 - 00:02:28.002

I'm a futurist, so I'm going to say good because it's hard to stop the flow of the ocean. You have to learn how to surf.

And if we say, well, there's a time in which women or certain types of people didn't have rights, you know, we're moving in that direction. We have to just embrace it. We don't care if you like the past the way it is.

Things are changing and we need to learn to adapt because otherwise we're choosing to be irrelevant and it's a bad choice to make.

Sean Cannell

00:02:28.106 - 00:02:34.242

What do you think the timeline of AI disruption, do you think it's going to go faster or slower than people are estimating?

Chris Do

00:02:34.386 - 00:03:14.370

Well, the estimates are wild, so I don't know which estimates, but I think it's happening and it's happening very, very fast.

Let's just take a look at mid journey in terms of the different models and the quality in which it's been able to achieve in the time in which it's been able to achieve. So in the very beginning, the images were a little wanky, extra fingers and weird things, and it's just wildly unpredict, predictable, very artistic.

The robot can dream really well, but not exactly something that you can reliably get a result from.

And then we start moving to more natural language descriptions and the fingers start getting resolved and type, and things start getting clearer and more focused and the amount that you can specify becomes even greater. We're not even talking a year's time in which there are three or four releases of the robot. It's incredible.

Sean Cannell

00:03:14.710 - 00:03:24.214

And ChatGPT is only one year old. I think it just had, or at least publicly it was being developed, of course, behind the scenes. A user of ChatGPT?

Chris Do

00:03:24.342 - 00:03:24.902

Absolutely.

Sean Cannell

00:03:24.966 - 00:03:25.990

How do you use it?

Chris Do

00:03:26.110 - 00:04:20.672

I use it to generate summaries for our own YouTube videos to them, to write descriptions and generate title ideas. I use it to translate video content into Instagram content. I use it to clean up what I'm writing. So I'll write a really ugly first draft.

The thing that is the most difficult for people is to write, like just to write, to express themselves.

Because what happens is most people, when they write, they don't just write from beginning to end, they write in the edit while they go because they want it to be right. So my new thing is I'm just going to write. It's going to be ugly, it's going to be messy, it's not going to be structured well.

I feed it back to chat and chat, rewrites it for me with the intention of what I'm writing, but formats it in the way that a normal person should understand. Cleans up a lot of language redundancy. And oftentimes it writes better than what I write.

It sounds less human, but it's grammatically structured way better than I have structured it. I usually use a hybrid approach, which is, right, dirty it, cleans it up and put the dirt back in at the. Usually at the beginning, at the end.

Sean Cannell

00:04:20.776 - 00:04:27.216

Are you using AI in any other ways at the future for your channel, other apps, software?

Chris Do

00:04:27.328 - 00:05:21.514

I know the team is. We talked about, like, using AI to clean up the audio so that really bad audio can be fixed. We can use it to fix flubs.

If you mess up the words, they can fix it without talking to me and rerecording. There's a lot that we can do with it, Editing, getting that first draft out, cutting shorts. It hasn't been great. It's a hit and miss kind of thing.

I'll take the full blame for it. Maybe the original content wasn't something that you can edit like that.

I'm sure someone like Gary Vaynerchuk would benefit from this because he speaks in sound bites and short pithy statements. So then the AI can pretty much pull that out for you. So I look at it like this.

I don't think any entrepreneur sits there and says to themselves, I want a thousand person team. What they want is the productivity of a thousand people, not to manage a thousand people.

And I tell people like we're a 12 person company, but we can act like a 50 person company while working less and doing better work and having higher quality of life. Who would refuse that?

Sean Cannell

00:05:21.602 - 00:05:34.762

What do you say to, especially as a designer yourself and you coach a lot of designers to the moral or ethical implications of AI getting involved in taking out the soul of design?

Chris Do

00:05:34.946 - 00:07:05.164

I think the soul as it relates to design is a human construct that if I showed you good work, I'm not sure you could tell that a human created or not. I think it's prejudice mostly because there's really bad soulful work done by humans and really beautiful non soulful work made by machines.

I think in this age when we can make anything, it becomes a question of why we should make it, not what we can make or who can make it for us.

And so I think we're going to see a whole new rise or the resurgence of skills that I think we used to and then we would pass up on, for example, art history, history, music history. We need to know our history because we need to be able to make clear references to the machine. It already knows the history. It's that you don't.

We're going to see rise in curators and people who have really good sense of style. We know this like maybe some people are born with a good sense of style.

Maybe it can be refined or you can learn it, but the machine can make lots of things. It's. It doesn't know if it's good or not. It knows it's rendered well.

It knows that the lighting ratio between the foreground and the background are good, but it's not necessarily good.

A human, I think, still needs to say, well, of all these really good images, this is the one that speaks to me, to the brand and communicates the message. It's the right feeling. And until the machine can know that curation, art history, those kinds of skills are going to be very important and good.

Old fashioned ability to communicate in written form, in verbal form, because you still need to direct the machine.

Sean Cannell

00:07:05.292 - 00:07:56.014

Recently on our team, I saw a skill gap. Trying to just get a square image out of a video that was vertical and the ability to just maybe in Photoshop it'd be very easy for me.

And I realized our social media manager said, I don't know how to use Photoshop, I just use Canva and was unaware of how to do that. And so I thought, huh, okay, is AI making people lazy? Probably a separate conversation.

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And do you think that there's still going to be a gap if people overestimate the capabilities? And do they still need to sharpen their skills to have a combination of skills? Will those be the most lethal?

You kind of spoke to, you need to know how to talk to the machine. Because perhaps actually Canva could have solved the problem, but he felt stumped. What are your thoughts?

Chris Do

00:07:56.142 - 00:09:38.372

I don't think tools make people lazy. I think tools reveal the person, that's all. It's never been any different. Microwave popcorn is not going to make you fat.

You got to go eat it or you got to not exercise. Those are the things that are going to make you fat. So what the tools allow us to do is to hopefully be less technical and be more creative.

And I think that's what is happening. So shooting and aspect ratios for video is very important. It's the thing that's been a bane of our existence. You must shoot vertical, horizontal.

And then now I can't reprocess it. Now what do we do? We gotta shoot 6K. So you can do a center crop to maintain resolution.

But the whole idea of framing and cropping is a dead idea because you can make it wider, you can make it narrow and you can reframe, you can add to the head to the feet. There's so much that you can do and we're just touching the tip of the iceberg.

So when we say lazy, then I think what we're saying is, are you going to be less intentional when you go to shoot?

Because now you're not thinking about the framing the way you used to and you're shooting for averages like, okay, instead of like getting the shot exactly the way I want, I shoot a little wider than I think I need. It's not as flattering for the person. I shoot a little flatter than I need and then I'll use the machine to fix it.

But I think it's just another crown in the box of tools that we get to use. And the Analogy I love to make is my brother, who's a software engineer tells me this. He goes, use Adobe Illustrator, right?

Would that make you lazy by using Illustrator? I'm like, why would you say that? It's still very difficult to do these drawings. Well, he says Adobe Illustrator is built on the postscript language.

As a software engineer, I'm writing the code to make the image. Would you like to learn how to do the code, you lazy bastard? Of course I wouldn't.

We use tools to enhance human creativity and productivity if it can enhance it. All I'm saying is it's just going to reveal the person that's underneath all that.

Sean Cannell

00:09:38.476 - 00:09:47.582

AI is a massive emerging trend. What other emerging trends do you see in design and digital media that content creators and business owners should be paying attention to?

Chris Do

00:09:47.716 - 00:10:41.556

Content creation. If you have a child, and what should that child be prepared for so that they have a future proof skill, or at least a skill that's in demand.

There are still demand for high touch things in person experiences. The machine can't replicate that. We get that. Let's put that aside.

If we look at like what the jobs of the future are going to look like, people who can articulate their thinking, that's really important. People who can direct the machine, that's going to be important. And we're going to need people to help them tell those stories.

So the artists, the content creators, the people who can write, who understand like, I see you're delivering this, but if you said it this way or tried it with this story before it, you're going to impact way more lives than than this. I mean, we're in a studio right now where someone's converted their home into a studio that's moving into the future right now.

These weird hybrid environments, helping people tell stories and creating content.

Sean Cannell

00:10:41.748 - 00:10:49.396

Have you heard that universities like Cornell and other schools have added content creation as part of their curriculum?

Chris Do

00:10:49.508 - 00:10:51.460

I haven't, but that's pretty hilarious to me.

Sean Cannell

00:10:51.580 - 00:10:59.556

What is your feeling about traditional university versus the new way of learning that you and I and others are pioneering?

Chris Do

00:10:59.748 - 00:11:56.264

I think each person has a different learning modality and have emotional connection to brands. So I don't think that person's going there to learn video. They're going there to get a piece of paper that says Cornell University.

I think that matters to them and it's okay because I'm not here to tell each person how to get their information. My son, for example, he just got accepted into Columbia and that made him really happy because it's an Ivy.

And before Then I'm like, I'll give you money, travel the world, do whatever you want. He goes, dad, I don't want that.

He couldn't tell me because it's a little bit too childish to say because I care about the name and it reflects my identity. But I recognize that. I'm like, that's cool. Those are your goals. You go and do that. That's not my goal for you. You get to do whatever you want.

So I can see that there will be a demand for people who are like parents saying, my son or daughter's at Cornell. And for that son or daughter say, I graduated from Cornell. But we're like, is that the very best video content program that you can go to?

Probably not. You probably should go to UCLA or USC or go to the School of Hard Knocks and YouTube University.

Sean Cannell

00:11:56.432 - 00:12:03.560

How are you thinking about the evolution of education? Do you think that universities have to change or can they keep doing what they're doing?

Chris Do

00:12:03.680 - 00:13:06.462

They get to keep doing what they're doing because people are bought into the system and it requires too much thinking, too much work for us to do something that's non standard.

But I'm hoping that there are pockets of entrepreneurs spread around different ideology who are experimenting with different models of education that hopefully will then rock the paradigm and it will start to change slowly and then it'll be like an avalanche. If we compare it to what Elon's been able to do with electric cars versus it's not going to work impractical.

It's just for like a few really forward, innovative thinkers and then it starts to like slip into is it going to be mainstream?

And then now it's so mainstream that I heard him say to stat on the launch of the cyber truck that they produce and sell more electric cars than all electric car companies in America combined. Not so much a joke anymore.

So it's like that there's one person who leads it, who has the resources, the commitment following through with it, who's all in on it, who's going to change the game? Maybe it'll be you, maybe me, maybe somebody we don't know yet, our children, who knows? But I believe it will change.

Sean Cannell

00:13:06.566 - 00:13:30.776

You mentioned Elon.

He a few weeks back posted on Twitter some anti Semitic and pro Nazi seeming stories and rhetoric and said he clarified in the comments but as a result advertisers pulled spending and when being interviewed they asked how do you feel about the advertisers pulling spending? And he said they can go F themselves.

Chris Do

00:13:30.888 - 00:13:32.808

Gfy, he said, am I clear?

Sean Cannell

00:13:32.944 - 00:13:48.088

Go F yourself. And do you think he's going to be blowing up his brand and doing antics like that? What's your feelings on the future of X?

And if that's also just a brand move that actually strengthens his brand, I'm.

Chris Do

00:13:48.104 - 00:15:38.878

Really conflicted on this. Elon is a person who's disrupted multiple industries. I feel like he's the second coming of Steve Jobs and what he's able to do.

I wish I could like all the things that he says and does, but I can't. And it's really causing a lot of inner conflict within me. Like what everybody says, elan, please just do what you do and just keep your mouth shut.

But he can't. He's autistic. I believe he's rich and he's spoiled that expression with power corrupts absolutely. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

And here's where he's at now.

So instead of trying to embrace it and saying, I make mistakes, I need to be more mindful of what I'm saying, he quadrupled down on this and said, go after yourself, I don't care. And he's like a child on stage with lots of money and saying, I won't share and screw you and oh yeah, see what I do to you.

And he made these threats to say like, the people decide they'll boycott. It's like, I think he's overestimating the loyalty of his fans now.

I think he's drifting into this identity politics to say like, well, I'm an independent guy who says F you to the big companies and there's going to be a whole bunch of people who are like, yeah, that's awesome. But look at underlying what's happening here.

He took a multibillion dollar brand, overpaid for it, then tried to unpay for it, which is wild, and then make all these weird changes to and destroy the brand. So the future of X I'm really concerned about as advertisers pull out and they're not worried about his threats.

He doesn't have all the cards, he doesn't get to make all the rules. And I'm glad, but he has incredible amount power, oversized amount, and it's kind of wild.

The fact that he controls Starlink and SpaceX means that governments have to come hand, open hand and say, elon, will you help us? That is almost too much power for one man. I love what he's doing, but I think sometimes we need somebody to say like, hey, timeout.

Sean Cannell

00:15:38.974 - 00:15:59.492

I heard that the most recent stats of how Much money you need to make a year globally to be in the top 1% of humans is right around $32,000. So obviously we can't compare you to Elon. There's a factor of more wealth there. But you're rich.

Chris Do

00:15:59.556 - 00:16:00.980

We're in the 1%. Is that what you're saying?

Sean Cannell

00:16:01.020 - 00:16:15.208

Well, you're rich, you're powerful, you got millions of subscribers. You can do whatever you want. When you see the power he has, you got a lot of power. How do you protect your heart from it corrupting you?

Chris Do

00:16:15.344 - 00:17:27.230

I'm driven by doing something that's greater than me, and that's to help other people.

It's linked to my origin story, the fact that refugees coming from Vietnam to come to America without a home can rebuild one and find ourselves here and to. To have a piece of the American dream. It's an obligation, I feel, to help other people at home and abroad. And.

And that's what's going to keep me pointed forward. We just had this conversation about money. Like, how much money do you need to have before it's like, what do you do without money?

I'm not going to spend it. So to have more money is what, a sense of security, ego? What are we going to do with this?

I'd rather just use the money to go and make more content, to help more people, hire more teachers, and just scale up what we're doing to levels in which I think people are not fully comprehending. You and I were very rare as creators on YouTube compared to the vast majority in which many of them are just making content in the bedroom.

They're not really building a business or a brand, and we're in a place where we can actually spend the money to do what we want to do at scales in which they can't. And I think that's a pretty big responsibility. I'm a big fan of Spider Man. There's this line that says, with great power comes great responsibility.

And somebody flipped it on me, said, with great responsibility, Chris, comes great power. So we have to play both sides of that.

Sean Cannell

00:17:27.350 - 00:17:48.760

Is there anything else that you do to stay humble, stay grounded? And in your career over the last few years, have you struggled with fame or awareness?

Have you ever gone through any evolution as you started getting more exposure or more known? Was it just a steady climb and you always had mental toughness or how have you wrestled through honestly, success?

Chris Do

00:17:49.060 - 00:19:34.772

I think we have to pay our dues and learn how to deal with our own ego and success at some point in our life.

I just paid for it mostly at the beginning, which growing up poor, being different, being bullied and picked on by other people, feeling ostracized by whatever communities I was in, I had to learn to love myself.

And I say this kind of half heartedly with tongue in cheek, but the most confident people that you're ever going to see are overweight lesbians because they've had to learn to love themselves really early on. And the ones that I do are so powerful when I see them.

Like everybody could just take a chapter from your book, Ryan, and learn how to love yourself the way you do. And I admire that.

So if you had a pretty pampered life and you didn't deal with a lot of adversity, you have some fortune and some fame, I think it could destroy you in lots of different ways. We've seen it happen time and time again to different types of people.

So I think having a good family, foundation, sense of values, and then being tested early starts to like, make you travel inward versus outward to learn who you are, what you stand for, such that you have this resolve not to bend. I heard this child therapist, he's written many best selling books.

He said on stage something, and I thought it was so important, it was at my children's school. He said, your children have something called will. Do not dominate them. Do not destroy their will by saying, you must do what mom or dad says.

Because they're going to need that strength of will when they're tested, when you're not around, when their friends say, do this, steal this, do this drug or hurt this person, they need that strength of will to say, no, first of all, you guys, stop. I'm not participating in this and you should not do this.

So when you break their will, you break also their will to be able to stay true to themselves in situations where they're going to really need it. And that really hit home for me.

Sean Cannell

00:19:34.876 - 00:19:44.852

You're a brand expert not just by knowledge, but I think by career. You have the real receipts. Brand gets thrown around. What does it even mean?

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Chris Do

00:19:44.956 - 00:21:01.200

Okay, you're right. Brand does get thrown around because it's such a 21st century concept and word and there's some history behind this.

And just for a little context, it's like when we have products that are competing in this market space and we have a good product, we've established reputation, we need to distinguish it from the other products so that people aren't confused in the marketplace.

So brand starts with just creating some distinctive elements, a logo, color palette, way it's packaged Just to say like this is the high quality one and this is the low quality One in the 21st century concept, I think in the last 50 to 100 years we, we've moved into this place. Now when we have highly niched verticals, we no longer make the grow our own food or raise our own livestock.

And so now we have a dependence on other people to provide these services to us. And so we're now connecting to those things.

Along the way, when we have so much abundance and we don't have to worry about our own food and clothing and shelter, we get to start to work towards what Maslow talks about is like a higher purpose, our sense of self, our self actualization. This is a very western modern concept because until you have enough, you're not worried about those crazy ideas.

So we want to learn how to be connected and to be able to express ourselves creatively.

Sean Cannell

00:21:01.620 - 00:21:19.514

Not to interrupt you, but what you're saying on the hierarchy of needs is at some level you need a T shirt because you need something to wear.

But it's only until you have more, more than enough, that now the logo on the T shirt becomes something of self expression and that is related to brand. Is that what I hear you saying?

Chris Do

00:21:19.602 - 00:23:16.272

Yes. And Marty Neumeyer, who has written multiple books on brand and branding, in his latest book, Brand Flip and he writes like, we don't buy anymore.

We join tribes. We're searching for meaning and identity. Who am I when I do these things? Who am I when I buy this?

And so what we're doing is we're reaffirming values in ourselves and we're signaling to others what we stand for. We do this all the time, you and I. If you wear a cross, it means you belong to a certain tribe of people.

If you carry a certain thing like a gun, that means you belong to a certain. It's like a lot of our own search for meaning and identity, like who am I? It's a very difficult question to answer.

So what we do is we join tribes, have a strong identity that we feel resonates with us and we also abandon them when they abandon what we think their values are.

So very modern thing that's happened in the last 10, 15 years thanks to the rise of social media, is the companies don't own the brand, the customers do.

Meaning if Nike does something that betrays the tribe and community of the people who are fan and followers of them, they say, no Nike, you've misstep. And what we will do now is we will abandon you. And then the corporates have to say, do we want to go out of business or do we need to revise?

This is the Elon moment. This is the Bud moment. And they all make different decisions based on a number of variables.

So now when your essence grows to a certain point, when there's enough people that show up and say you are this, when you betray them, they will leave you because that no longer represents who they are. And there's been a lot of power shifted away from corporations to people.

When a certain channel, program or person or company does something that's against those values, we the people say, we're going to boycott you. Advertisers pull out. They don't want to pull out because they're making money, but they either pull out or they suffer the wrath of the people too.

It's a really interesting, fascinating time to be alive because the power shifted to people.

Sean Cannell

00:23:16.376 - 00:24:07.174

You mentioned Bud Light. If you were consulting with Bud Light, they partner with Dylan Mulvaney, they put his face on the can. It dramatically affects their sales.

Billions, I believe the reman. It's still. There's still some lingering effects. Who knows how long it'll last, but was a pretty incredible moment.

What kind of consulting would you give to these big brands? And I don't know if you agree with this, but there's this idea that brands need to stand for something.

Do you think at scale brands, Coca Cola, Bud Light, actually kind of have to play it neutral to stay large? Because if you start really aligning with one tribe and ideology, you're now potentially losing billions of dollars.

How would you consult them of what they could learn from that situation and what they should do going forward?

Chris Do

00:24:07.342 - 00:25:41.120

The Bud Light one is a strange example of what you should never do, which is, is this really who you are? Is this the community you've developed? Or are you trying to be woke or tap into something that's trending right now?

And that's the worst thing, thing that you can do because you don't even have a leg to stand on, like we've always been for this. No, you haven't. It's been clear. And this is not reflective of your community. It's like cashing in on something.

And that's like corporate greed or somebody who's a little bit too smart trying to move the company in a direction that's not real for them.

I think at the end of the day, whether you alienate people or embrace them, it has to be reflective of who you are and your values, and that's important. Coca Cola being a multi billion dollar brand that's global. I don't think they're trying and have never been about polarization.

They're like the polar bears during Christmas kinds of people. Right? That the red Santa Claus people. And they're like refreshment. So they don't need to or nor should they veer from that message.

Their bigger concern is do people want to drink sugar water anymore? And that's the problem that they're working on. So I think it has to be true to you.

And Nike did this with Colin Kaepernick and it seems like it is consistent with Nike's values. It seems like it.

So there are a whole bunch of people burning their Nikes and barbecues like, yeah, and their sales went up because it's important for the people. Like, yeah, this is us and our tribe is here. We'll buy two pairs of shoes for everyone that that guy burns.

I'm not 100% certain that the person who burned that in an active demonstration or protest didn't actually go back and buy another pair.

Sean Cannell

00:25:41.200 - 00:26:14.858

We're talking at a huge level. Bud Light, Coca Cola.

But if we bring it all the way down to content creators, a brand new channel, or let's call it, you've got a thousand subscribers, ten thousand subscribers, maybe a hundred thousand. That's incredible. We know that you can make a full time income and even big money with a small audience, but you're playing a different game.

You're not Coke, you're not even mid sized. You are so niche. So how do you apply practical brand principles to a smaller YouTube channel?

Chris Do

00:26:14.994 - 00:28:24.668

You can actually apply the principles of branding and personal branding with zero followers. Because what we're talking about here is the associations that people have with you. Positive, negative, neutral. And that's happening all the time.

When you go to the grocery store and the person who bags your groceries, you could say a kind word. And if you visit that place enough, they're like, Sean's a really nice guy, he's really sweet, he doesn't need to be nice to me.

And you take a point to say, hey, I love the new haircut, like I didn't even know you notice. So you're establishing an association that Sean cares and he pays attention to things.

Conversely, somebody's real grumpy, cuts people in line, brings 14 items to a 12 item line. You'll go, you're that kind of person. I see. And that's association. So we're building our brand all the time.

What happens is when we're Doing it on media platforms is we're amplifying that message and our ability to reach way more people than the local grocery store. And this is where it gets real interesting.

What happens is when people create content online, the first thing they do is they create content that's nothing like themselves. They're a little scared to be judged. They want to be professional, they want to seem intelligent. So they're putting their best foot forward.

It's like you going on your first date on a blind date, but you can only go on a first date on a blind date, I think one time. That's the problem here. So eventually you have to make this decision, which many people struggle with apparently, is when do I get to be myself?

And some people will make content for years and never be themselves.

And you and I are in circles well enough that we know when we run into something like, oh my God, you are nothing like that person you portray on camera. And that's a problem for us. There is some kind of cognitive dissonance where this person was very charismatic and kind on camera.

And in real life, they're awkward, they're weird, and they're unkind. So now we walk away saying, forget that person. This is the real person, and that's a problem.

So this is a problem, and the solution is, let go of this person, show up as this person and just be yourself. You may not have the most number of followers, but you have people who actually show up for you. And it's something that I think we all would want.

It's very tiring to pretend to be somebody.

Sean Cannell

00:28:24.764 - 00:29:07.602

Do you recommend somebody because you say be yourself and there's authenticity and vulnerability is kind of a buzzword. Vulnerability in some cases feels like it might be over amplified, that it's becoming almost a tactic.

Do you think that you're saying, and we agree, that being fake and cognitive dissidents is wrong? Do you think being extremely vulnerable and just putting it all out there, that might be the other extreme?

How do you strike a balance of creating a character when you are essentially a character in your content and being authentic, but also being strategic and maybe you're amplifying certain things? And how do you do that ethically?

Chris Do

00:29:07.746 - 00:30:34.766

I think of it like this, Sean. You're a husband, you're a creator, you're a parent. You're not moving through life exactly the same to all those situations.

And it's because context matters a lot. If your child's having a bad moment, you can't be Sean. The content creators like, what do you Feel about that.

Let me interview you and get you on camera. That doesn't make sense. You don't speak to your children the way you do to your wife. You know, you'd be sleeping on the couch a lot if you did.

So we're changing modalities, we're shifting all the time. And that's okay because we're really smart at understanding context. You don't wear gym shorts to church. It doesn't seem right.

And you don't want to wear a three piece suit also to the beach doesn't seem right. So it's okay for you to shift context. But when you're doing it in an artificial way to game the system, if you will.

So for example, if you're not a person who likes to swim and you try to impress your date and you're like, let's go to the beach and let's do this and like, let's go swimming, Sean. You're like, I don't want to swim. Then that whole illusion breaks. Unfortunately, a lot of people do this.

They posture and they pretend to be something. And then what happens is it creates massive amount of paranoia, fear that eventually when you pull the string, it all comes undone.

Hence those videos where people say, truth about Ellen, truth about this celebrity, they're totally fake. And then the community, the audience, everybody goes crazy because like, I knew it, I knew that person was fake.

And then their whole they get canceled, their career just crumbles. It's a horrible way to end a story, don't you think?

Sean Cannell

00:30:34.838 - 00:30:35.278

Yes.

Chris Do

00:30:35.374 - 00:31:17.316

So I think it's like when we show up on camera, you want to be prepared if you want to be seen as professional. You play the part, you dress the part and you speak. But I think some part of your personality needs to come through. Some part of real life happens.

And it's not all manufactured for the machine and for consumption. I think that's the important part. And so, so many people forget that part and they hold that back. And conversely, I agree with you.

There are a lot of people who are very almost like too authentic, too vulnerable as a manufactured thing to get a response from other people. And I think human beings are very good at spotting it. And so, like, I don't trust you. I think that's a ploy. Why are you crying right now?

It doesn't even make sense.

Sean Cannell

00:31:17.388 - 00:31:22.484

Hit record on that. Pull the phone out, set it down. Hit record. Yeah, yeah, start crying.

Chris Do

00:31:22.532 - 00:31:24.084

Let me get a little hot sauce.

Sean Cannell

00:31:24.212 - 00:31:27.400

Obviously you had to set the phone up to capture yourself.

Chris Do

00:31:27.980 - 00:31:46.004

You can tell, right yeah, it just doesn't. Our spider sense is pretty good with that kind of stuff.

So I, I think if you're having a genuine moment, the thing to do, it's just to feel it and let it out versus bottle it up. And if you're not feeling it, don't like let me work on the waterworks here. You're not that good of an actor is what I'm saying.

Sean Cannell

00:31:46.092 - 00:32:39.546

Yeah, that's so good. So we're talking about very practical, but also some abstract aspects of brand. What would you say if a content creator, YouTuber listening to this?

They'll want it to get into like a practical checklist. And I've heard the term brand a thon before, which was like maybe a dedicated week or two weeks, especially in a brand new year.

If I was like, man, I want to kind of do an overhaul. What would your checklist be in a YouTube context?

Text, maybe all the way down granularly to cover image, avatar, thumbnails, look, how would you audit and our personal level? Is there any a book to read, a checklist to go through? A couple of things if I wanted to.

If you will update my brand or it's already, you know, you're not manufacturing something. What would you say?

‍

Chris Do

00:32:39.618 - 00:34:11.274

I'll do this in a way that I haven't done before. Let's go step by step. Okay.

The first thing I would do is if I'm ready to reveal myself and say, you know what, I'm ready to like have a real conversation with people. What I would do is show up just like this, wherever we are and say, okay, guys, I've realized something.

I've been showing up a certain way and I have to confess to you, I'm not wearing pants. They stand up and they're wearing shorts. And let me take the camera, I'm just going to turn the other way.

So on this side of the camera, it looks like this. On the other side, unmade bed, there's a bowl of cereal, a dirty pot. So I'm just going to show you, like, really, this is what it's about.

I show up like this because I want you to see me as a professional. But moving forward, I'm going to start revealing more of myself.

I hope you're along for the journey and if this turns you off, I appreciate the time you spent with me. And if you want to see more, let me know in the comments. And this is what I'm going to do because it's for me and it's not necessary for you.

And here's the weird thing.

It's my prediction, if you do it in a genuine way, maybe you get a little bit of coaching, then people are going to really say, thank God, finally somebody's doing it. And it's going to go against the grain. Anytime you want to stand out and disrupt a pattern, you got to do the opposite of what everybody's doing.

So when most people are like turning on filters and glam filters and pristine lighting and everything, I'm just going to do a little different and that will be the thing that breaks through and that's really what you want anyways.

It's like you're inviting people quite literally into your home so that you can have a conversation with them and they're going to feel so much more connected on a heart level, not on a brain level to you. That's going to be really meaningful.

Sean Cannell

00:34:11.402 - 00:34:48.196

And so that speaks to maybe a video that's so powerful somebody could shoot. But let's talk about it from like the design side. I coach a lot of people. They suck at design.

The content creator Plight, and all they did was pick up their smartphone or Sony ZV1. They started making videos and they might have gotten relatively far. What's amazing is they're breaking every rule you teach.

But if they wanted to improve the design and the look and the logo aspect, but they're the solo creator and they're lean resources, how could they get better at design?

Chris Do

00:34:48.348 - 00:37:47.416

I'm moving into different space. I'm trying to teach creative principles to non creatives. So I have an exercise I give them.

When they're doing this personal branding stuff with me, I say go to the supermarket, preferably one that's highly curated. Because they only pick the very best design products in the world, right? Because they can shop from anywhere.

You can go to Whole Foods and Erewhon, Dean and deluca. You can go into one of those shops and like, oh, okay, go through the aisle way, find something that speaks to you.

Find a package of like a food product that you like. Like, oh, I like this. I like the typeface, I like the colors, I like the visual language.

I like that it's impressionistic painting or it's a geometric Memphis style illustration that. I like the patterns, I like the way they write and the words and everything about it.

I like, take that thing home, unpack it, wrap, lay it out flat and say, okay, I'm going to like be a master designer now. Pick apart the elements. I wonder what typeface that is. Well, there's an app for that just Shoot it with your phone and identify the typeface for you.

Oh, that is Rockwell. Boom. Okay, great. Rockwell, semi bold. Okay. And are they using all caps or upper lowercase? What parts of this do you like?

I like this shade of pink, that shade of green, and a little hint of metallic gold. Understand the ratio of how they're using it. It's just a little bit of gold, lots of pink and some green. So it's like a 70, 25. 5 ratio.

So when you're designing your thumbnails, think about the 75, 25. What kind of illustration style is this? Try to figure that out. Now you can teach yourself design and art.

So we're not so good at invention, but we're really good at replicating. When you're in art school, the way that you learn to draw is you literally copy the masters. As close as you can determines your ability to draft.

So you might look at a da Vinci drawing or a Michelangelo or something, and you're like, okay, let me just. How did they interpret the lighting? Oh, Caravaggio did it this way. Okay. You just keep doing that, and then you start to learn.

And through the process of absorbing their technique as a human, you can't help it but to inject some of your thing into it. If you do this enough, eventually it becomes this weird hybrid new thing that becomes your voice. So you'll never be able to replicate it perfectly.

That's okay. Get really close and you'll see your thumbnail game, your design sensibility, go really, really high.

If you practice this throughout the rest of your life. When you go to a hotel and there's a really good menu, study it. Take a couple of pictures.

Do the same thing when you go to a store boutique and you pull something out. Don't just look at the garment, look at the hang tag. Look at how they package it.

I recently bought some off white shoes, and it comes in this mint green box with a clear plastic sleeve. And I was like, who packages things like this? Virgil does. You pull this off and you're going through like, wow, this is super interesting.

There's a whole intentional design thinking that's going on here that you can learn a lot from. Just keep doing that over and over again. You're not going to be. I was joking.

You're not going to become a master designer, but you'll be masterful in what you do.

Sean Cannell

00:37:47.508 - 00:38:42.394

There's a famous copywriter named Gary Halbert, and he encouraged people that wanted to get better at writing to take top 100 ad copy and ads and actually copy them word for word, handwritten In Pen, for 100 days, as many days as possible, to reprogram your conscious mind to your unconscious mind, to. To see not just the words, but the rhythm and how direct response copy is written. That is effective.

Direct response ads that were incredibly effective, so that you absorb those and you become better. The quote has been thrown around, quoted by Steve Jobs, perhaps Pablo Picasso said it first. Good artists copy. Great artists steal.

Do you believe that? And how do you solve that? Maybe cognitive dissonance that people hear, like, wait a minute, you're telling me to steal?

And what's the difference between that and plagiarism?

Chris Do

00:38:42.522 - 00:41:38.194

I think there's some misunderstanding with that. So we have to unpack that. Good artists borrow, great artists steal. You're talking about a masterful artist who said this.

And so Picasso's journey is that he can paint like Raphael and the masters by the time he was, like, 12, so it became boring for him. So he learned how to copy the paintings. And he doesn't become known until much later in terms of his distinct style.

What they're saying is you have to become a student of the game. So if you want to become a great director, you need to read screenplays, you need to watch films.

And what people do is they borrow a little bit, and they think they got it. My children like this. When I try to explain them how to do something, they want to take the shortcut.

They just want to skip all over the steps and just like, no, I got it, dad. Then when they produce something like, yeah, see, that didn't work because you didn't follow the directions. And people are like this.

We think we're smarter than we really are. It takes a lot of patience, dedication, believe it or not, intelligence to do really great forgeries.

Some of the great forgers are like very high IQ people. They pay attention to crazy amounts of detail.

So you need to do that for a period of time so that you can get a feel for the words, get a feel for how to frame a shot or how to light a scene before you can go out and do your thing. And so the classic example is this, and I use a lot. The Karate Kid, Mr. Miyagi, Daniel. It's like, daniel, just do what I tell you to do.

That was his condition in teaching Daniel, because he didn't want to teach Daniel. So Mr. Miyagi's like, wax on, wax off. Just like this. No, like this. Stand like this, hold your hand. He's like, why is this guy being so particular?

About this. Then wax on, wax off, the same thing. Paint the fence. Okay? You just keep doing it over and over again. Then he gets really frustrated.

He's like, you told me you're going to teach me karate. We've been doing nothing but all your chores. And he goes, daniel, paint the fence. And he tries to hit him. He's like, do this and do that. Wax on.

He's like, oh my God. So that's like made for fiction or made for cinema. But the principles are true.

If somebody were to come and work for me and say, chris, I love how you make these beautiful Photoshop frames. First day. For the next few days, all you need is cut out images and you're gonna like hate this. Why am I rotoscoping? Why am I using channels?

Why am I using remove background comment? Because it's how you learn how to cut stuff out. You wanna learn from me? You wanna go out the door?

You gotta do it the way I tell you because this is gonna get you there. So the poor student tells the master how to teach them. The good student says, yes, and just keeps doing Kill Bill.

The same thing, same thing, over and over again.

I have this feeling, and I don't think I'm alone in this, that movies and books are messages from the past to our future selves so that we can learn from them to save ourselves from a lot of pain. But many of us are so stubborn. Our eyes are not fully open and.

And so when these messages come to us on screen, we laugh, we cry, and we move on with our life. And we forget. There's a powerful lesson here. You're a Christ follower. There's a message there for you to read and understand that's 2,000 years old.

But people don't want to listen.

Sean Cannell

00:41:38.322 - 00:41:41.042

What did you mean by Kill Bill? The same as Kill Bill.

Chris Do

00:41:41.146 - 00:42:33.168

Uma Thurman, when Bill introduces her to, I think his name is Pai Mei, this old Chinese kung fu master, she's, I think, emblematic of what's wrong with students. She's proud or prideful. She's headstrong. She's a Westerner trying to learn in Eastern art. She's like, I know how to do this.

You know how many people I kill? And he gets up there and he's like, if you can hit me one time with your sword, I will beg for mercy and we'll be done with this.

And he humiliates her and he treats her like a dog until she starts to learn and put in the work. The one inch punch, everything that he tells her to do, she does with obedience and he actually starts to love her and it's a very interesting thing.

And then he teaches her the eight Palm strike or whatever that's called, which Bill never even learned because Uma became the perfect student. She was willing to copy the master when people were just willing to borrow.

Sean Cannell

00:42:33.344 - 00:42:36.940

If I wanted to read some books on Brand, what would you suggest?

Chris Do

00:42:37.320 - 00:43:11.594

Probably pick up the Brand Flip from Marty Neumeyer. I mean if you just read Brand Flip, you'd you do really well for yourself.

It's not 100% like practical steps, but it'll give you a really good high level overview. Part of Brand is being a good storyteller.

So I would tell you read how to Tell a Story by the Moth Group and probably Stories that Stick by Kendra hall so you understand the concepts of brand that you need to tell story. And there's probably a book you need to read about customer experience, user experience and culture.

I would tell you to read Delivering Happiness by Tony Hsieh. The three of them make a pretty deadly triangle.

Sean Cannell

00:43:11.722 - 00:43:30.586

We'll link those up of course in the show notes and I always love your reading list and I want to circle back on that later, especially for just content creators in general. But before we move on, speaking of the content creator, people are on social media platforms. How important is having a website in 2024?

Chris Do

00:43:30.738 - 00:43:50.194

It's important as a final destination.

At the beginning people are going to find you through social first and then they're going to need to find something where it's all collected and it's organized and then you get to control the format, the look and the length which you're restricted by on other platforms. I think it is important, but not at the beginning, but at the end of a journey.

Rebecca

00:43:50.322 - 00:43:52.910

It's time for a quick break, but we'll be right back.

Chris Do

00:44:01.130 - 00:44:22.200

Want to make the most of the opportunities coming your way this year? I'd like to invite you to join me inside the Future Pro Membership, your ace in the hole for 2024. With expert guidance and a supportive community.

The Future Pro Membership was created as your ultimate business lifeline and we have years testimonials from members to prove it. Check it out@thefuture.com Pro.

Rebecca

00:44:26.020 - 00:44:28.800

And Rebecc. Welcome back to our conversation.

‍

Sean Cannell

00:44:29.630 - 00:44:37.734

I went to your website and I can hire you for $4,999 for one hour of coaching. Why are you worth that and how did you come to that number?

Chris Do

00:44:37.822 - 00:45:58.446

I'm not worth that. Only the buyer determines that worth that's just the price I set.

And I came to that number because I was booked too much at $1,500 an hour, $14.99 an hour, since you were so precise. So my strategy, and it's something I tell people to do, when you get booked too much, you need to raise your rates.

I don't believe in making incremental increases. I want to make a seismic jump. I want to move really far forward. Selling my time is not scalable.

And it is exhausting for me to talk to someone, give them all of my attention for one hour. And I keep thinking, what kind of buyer do I want to attract? So pricing is positioning.

So when you set your price at $100,000 an hour, you're going to attract a certain type of person. That kind of person is probably a go getter, doesn't need tactical steps, needs to hear one or two things from you that's going to change their game.

And the kind of impact that person's going to make by implementing one of the two things that you say is going to be profound. They're playing at a whole different level.

I also believe the person who pays a ton of money is so vested in hearing what you have to say, they're so ready to do it that you're not going to get the normal resistance. If it was $1.99, those people are going to say, why would this work? What evidence do you have?

Oh, tomorrow's a good day to start, or why should I listen to you? I'm like, I'm done. I'm bored with you already. I'm going to Mr. Miyagi yet.

Sean Cannell

00:45:58.518 - 00:46:02.670

Would you generally encourage people to raise their prices? Entrepreneurs?

Chris Do

00:46:02.830 - 00:46:21.006

Yes, in general, because we don't know what the ceiling is. Your job is to find the ceiling. Your job is to find the ceiling, to set it so far that people keep saying no.

And then to acquire the skills to close the skill gap. And that's the game of life. You take the ball, you throw it as far as you can, and then you run after it and you keep throwing it. That's it.

Sean Cannell

00:46:21.078 - 00:46:24.062

What is the most you've paid for education?

Chris Do

00:46:24.246 - 00:46:26.090

Probably my business coach.

Sean Cannell

00:46:26.550 - 00:46:27.582

How much?

Chris Do

00:46:27.766 - 00:46:34.846

I should know this number. I forget now, but I worked with him for 13 years. I paid him every single month. I could do the math real quick.

Sean Cannell

00:46:34.998 - 00:46:37.726

Well, how much month did it go up?

Chris Do

00:46:37.878 - 00:46:43.592

No, it didn't go up a month. I think it was three grand a month. So times 13 years, what would you.

Sean Cannell

00:46:43.616 - 00:46:48.856

Say to somebody that can't comprehend that and Says, how could that possibly be worth it?

Chris Do

00:46:49.008 - 00:48:39.604

I would tell that person they're asking the wrong kinds of questions. That's the question that poor people ask. And I'll tell you why.

Because within one of the first meetings, literally the first meeting I had with him, he saved me from making a disastrous business decision. I was going to start a second business that was a complete distraction. One that didn't give me joy. I didn't even know why I was doing it.

One that didn't give me strong financial returns, yet I was committed to doing it. For some crazy reason, he gave me permission to change my mind. It's a powerful thing.

And then when I asked him to look at why I was not winning jobs that were over $200,000, we sat down, we talked. In two conversations, he fixed the problem for me, and he allowed us to go from $2.2 million to $3.9 million.

And I credit him for the person who was the architect of that. Think about this for a second. Two conversations. Almost $2 million, double our revenue. But that's like, for the rest of my life.

And so that was six years into our business. We ran that service business for 25 years. So the rest was just gravy. Here's the beautiful part.

I got to teach my directors how to sell based on what I learned from him. And they were closing jobs. So now I got all this free time again because I don't have to be on the calls anymore. It was a beautiful thing.

And now I get to speak about it. I can write a book about it. And so the knowledge in which he shared with me applied over time in real life situations. What is that value? $10 million?

It's probably worth more than that. It's worth more than that because throughout the lifetime of our business, so from years 5 to years 25, I applied his knowledge moving forward.

So every year, a low year would be $4 million. A high year would be about six and a half million. I don't know what that is now. I don't. The math is beyond me. That's the value.

So people who keep focusing too much on price and not in value, that's what poor people do.

Sean Cannell

00:48:39.692 - 00:48:41.444

I did the math. 15 years.

Chris Do

00:48:41.532 - 00:48:42.692

You didn't do the math. Your calculator.

Sean Cannell

00:48:42.756 - 00:48:58.944

My calculator did the math. But 15 years, right? $3,000. You paid a business coach, you paid him $540,000. But as you just explained, the value you got was 20, 30x that investment.

Chris Do

00:48:59.112 - 00:50:18.318

I'll say this. People ask me, so why did you stop? Because, one, I'm grateful, I'm loyal. So those two, why didn't you stop?

Yeah, because, like, what else did you learn in the last 13 years? Was it always that impactful? Truth be told, no. We would meet, we would talk sometimes about life, about my children, something.

And not all of it was profound. Not all of it is going to be a game changer. It can't be.

You can't let the bar of expectations because he hit it so far out of park that every meeting has to be like, that's not going to be like that. And because he did this for me, I was like, you kind of bought this for the next 10 years, so we're going to just do that.

And so I'm a person who understands how to be grateful and to reciprocate so someone can help me. I understand the value of that. And I say this because it's an important thing to understand.

When you have a brand and you create a relationship and you create a transformation for people, it's asymmetrical.

You could have created such profound impact on one person's life that's drastically different than these other people, and they're all going to measure it differently. And so I'm not shy to tell people, if I've helped you, then help me. I've done it. I've been consistent.

And unfortunately, not everybody does that because our company should be much bigger. But I'm not going to be from an entitled place. I'm like, I'll keep earning it.

I'm going to deliver so much value to you that you feel guilty not to give me money. That's a pretty good business model, I think.

Sean Cannell

00:50:18.454 - 00:51:03.690

And really, not only were you expressing loyalty and gratitude, but you were also playing with house money because you'd already had such an exponential return. And I've been similar coaching situations where months could go by, but all I needed.

And if I get one idea in one year, if you got one idea in 10 years and you applied it, if someone's trying to figure out their brand, you could call it a niche, their niche or their channel topic. You've broken down icky guy before. Explain that concept for somebody that maybe is like, I want to start a new YouTube channel.

I'm trying to figure out about what I'm committed to starting a channel, but I'm not sure about what could that be helpful?

Chris Do

00:51:03.850 - 00:53:35.728

So the concept is this is that we've been entirely focused on usually three dimensions. First dimension is what you're good at, what you love. And what pays well, and that's the pursuit. It's very Western concept.

Ikigai is a Japanese concept. I know the purists will find fault with me and I apologize in advance. It's like ikigai means like a way of being.

And in places in Japan, there seems to be great joy in just doing mundane things. And it's a beautiful culture, one that is worth studying. They introduce a fourth dimension, which is what the world needs.

So when you look at what you're good at, what you love, what pays well and what the world needs, you find this really interesting cross section. Now, the more dimensions you add, the harder this thing becomes, right? Two dimensions, the easy to find the overlap.

So in the Venn diagram, there's four circles. Like, the question of what the world needs is really important.

Speaking for myself here, when I made commercials for a living, I got paid a lot of money. So I was good at it and it paid really well, but didn't really fill my, like, do I love doing this?

Do I love clients telling me, like, make it bigger? Or can we try four more versions of the same thing? No, not really. Put that aside.

So I go to teach something I really love and I'm also good at, but they don't pay jack for that. So I can have a sense of fulfillment, but I'm going to be broke doing this. And so I struggle with these two worlds.

I thought you quite literally had to leave one world, the business world, to go in to join the academic world. And the two cannot intersect. So a friend of mine is like, hey, Chris, I know you're really passionate about education.

Why don't we just make content on YouTube and then build a knowledge product and that way you can teach and do this sustainably and we can do this. I'm like, hell, no, I'm not going to do that. I don't want to do that. That seems crazy.

Well, we know how that turned out because we're like 2,000 videos in so many subscribers later, I found that intersection.

So the world needs high quality education from people who've been there and done it before and that are passionate, that have a skill for teaching and entrepreneurship and know how to make videos and do storytelling. I found that intersection, and so I think I found my reason for being. And it's going to be different for each person.

And so when I do that, I feel most fulfilled. I'm in the highest alignment of myself and I'm creating tremendous value for others and I get some of it back. That works really well. For me.

So those are the people who are out there on YouTube. You've already now gotten one part of the platform figured out. You just need to fill in the other parts and find that perfect intersection.

Sean Cannell

00:53:35.824 - 00:54:05.058

What is your opinion on competition? If I go through those four circles in the Venn diagram, I'm excited to start a new YouTube channel in 2024. But when I say, what does the world need?

Well, I love branding and design. The future, Chris, the world, it's already too crowded.

There's no more room to start a branding and design YouTube channel and there's no channel for me to start. What would you say?

Chris Do

00:54:05.194 - 00:55:28.170

I would say because you're looking at it from the wrong point of view. There's a lady, I forget her name now, but she blew up on TikTok because she's like, you know, these are ugly logos. I'm going to redraw them.

And she purposely redraws them really bad. She takes global recognized logos designed by masses and she just punks everyone and does it.

And I'm watching these videos, at first I thought it was serious. I'm like, you can't do not change the type. Oh my God, I can't believe you're doing that.

And she's getting a reaction from people like me, like, how dare you touch that logo that you should never touch. And she's doing these and it's blowing up. Now famous established brands are like, do us next, do us next. And they pay her to do that.

So the question you should be asking yourself is, how do I compete against Chris?

No, how do you do it in the way that feels true to you, based on your gifts, based on your height, your skin color, your tone of voice, whatever it is, your shape, your size, your quirks. Like, if you like doing puppets, why don't you teach me designing logos with puppets? I can't do that. You can freestyle rap. Do that. Teach it that way.

There's room. There's so much room.

And I find it quite fascinating that in the society that we live in today, there's so many very narrow niches that turn out to be much bigger than we think. There are people who do dance videos for a very specific type of dance, and there's ones that will do it for kids.

So even in the same genre, they do it a little bit different. Or the ones who wear costumes or ones that wears a mask or who adds laser lights to it. Do it your way.

Sean Cannell

00:55:28.710 - 00:55:48.152

Whenever we approach a new year, I know personally it's goal setting. What can I learn from the last year. How can I improve next year? How can I up my game this next year? Specifically in content creation?

You're a content creator. How are you approaching creating engaging content and platforms like YouTube and Instagram?

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Chris Do

00:55:48.296 - 00:57:52.590

Really good question. Our main goal is to catch up to this one YouTube channel. I think it's called Think something. There's this guy, Sean, is super annoying.

He's always ahead of us, and we can't seem to catch up. And so it's really. It's just really frustrating. I'm like, team, what are we not doing? How come Sean keeps killing us?

Because the way I look at it, it's friendly competition. Obviously, I respect you. I'm like, who's the next mile marker? For whatever reason, I just picked you. I'm like, you're the guy.

We picked a lot of other people. We passed them. So it's now there's a guy that is not going to slow down. He has a team, so it's not going to be able to catch up to this guy.

So I keep asking our team, how do we need to do things differently, better? What is working for us, what isn't? And I don't want to wait a year to figure this stuff out.

We're doing these conversations, like, every week, every month. Like, what do we need to do?

I think this idea of the annual reset is fascinating, and I think we should never, ever wait for a January date to appear before we start thinking about this. But I do understand why it works because it's kind of really built around seasons, right? And we have different seasons.

So as we come out of the winter season, which is our season for rest, for reflection, it gives us opportunity to kind of recalibrate. And I think that's the important part. So as much as I abhor the idea of starting in January as a New Year's resolution, I.

I too am saying in January, I'm going to do this because I'm going on what I think is going to be a pretty profound trip for me. For the first time in my life, I'm going back to Vietnam. We're going to be there for four weeks.

I'm just going to be with my family and be connected to culture I haven't seen upfront or up close. And I want to use that time just to, like, not think about work. So everybody's like, what do we want to do? I'm like, just chill. I don't care.

Don't worry about it. The numbers don't need to be anything. Don't worry. I'll address it when I come back.

And I know this every time I give my brain an opportunity to think, to reflect, and not to be constantly grinding and putting out fires, the best ideas emerge. And I'm just so looking forward to, like not thinking about anything so that I can think about something really profound.

I think we just have to give our subconscious mind time to rest and recover. And when we do that, great things will come.

Sean Cannell

00:57:52.760 - 00:58:17.186

So one of the things on your calendar is rest after rest. And maybe you haven't defined this yet. Do you have a target that you know now as far as volume, certain number of videos a week?

The team is chopping things up and amplifying it. But do you know off the top of your head what your current target is and how many original pieces of content or podcasts you're doing?

What's kind of the checklist for you for podcasts?

Chris Do

00:58:17.218 - 00:59:32.342

It's clear to me that releasing once a week will keep us on pace, but it will not move us up.

I have to figure out a strategy where I can not only release one episode a week, but maybe possibly two episodes a week, which is going to be a little nutty. Now my friend Rich is here. He's like, I have a way for you to do that. I'm like, great, love it. Let's do that. We will try that.

We know that frequency does help, but frequency with the right kind of content is like gasoline. It's going to just turn everything up in terms of the YouTube channel, not really in terms of a number. Here's what we've learned.

People like long form content from us. The shorts don't perform well. I'm not doing skits, I'm not doing those kinds of things that are the things that people want in a short.

They want super snappy entertaining bits. We don't do that. It's hard for me to teach in a 60 second clip.

So we're going to reinvest our energy in producing much fewer shorts, maybe even fewer mids. We're just going to go for long form content and try to use the footage that we've already captured. This last year.

When I'm out and I'm teaching, I'm best in front of real people. They get me excited, my brain turns on.

I'm like, I have to be ready to answer anything and everything and I'm working at a higher level and we're going to start releasing that kind of content. But it's just a number game for me. We just got to catch up To Sean, that's it.

Sean Cannell

00:59:32.446 - 00:59:34.662

What is your definition of long form content?

Chris Do

00:59:34.846 - 00:59:36.406

45 minutes and beyond.

Sean Cannell

00:59:36.518 - 00:59:37.078

Okay.

Chris Do

00:59:37.174 - 01:00:12.458

Believe it or not, Sean, I think it's an anomaly for our channel that the longer the content it is, the more views it gets. It's really weird. So we take a long form, we chop it into like three to five minute episodes. They do not perform as well as long form one.

And people are like, don't even edit them. Like what they're like, we want to just hear the conversation as it flows.

So I think what's happening is they'll turn it on, they'll do different things and if you're really chopping it up, like they have to pay attention versus like we just want to feel it and then we'll rewind, we'll watch other parts. They just want a longer form conversation from us. It's different from other channels.

Sean Cannell

01:00:12.554 - 01:00:42.638

I want to challenge what you said about shorts because I was just studying your channel, so maybe something changed. But you have like a 50 million viewed short now. Many multimillion viewed shorts, hundreds of thousands.

So do you think something changed or how do you reconcile that? Because you mentioned steering away from Shorts. I know it is still 50 billion views a day is how many views YouTube shorts are getting.

Are you completely ignoring them? Are you just saying they're going to be less of your strategy?

Chris Do

01:00:42.814 - 01:02:41.926

Okay, I think we are the beneficiaries of what many people were when YouTube launch shorts. Not a lot of people were doing it. So we just did it and we picked up a ton of new followers.

It's the only way we were sort of able to catch up close to you was because of shorts. We picked up almost a million new subs because of shorts.

But as everyone started to come to the realization they need to create shorts, the market became super saturated with shorts. And now they weren't giving you that free traffic that they were before. The video in which you're referencing is kind of an anomaly for us.

It's based on a long form video that got 4 million views that when we chopped it down to a short, it got 50 million views or something like that. And here's the weird thing, we just re cropped it and that video got 10 million views.

So maybe I need to do like an animated version of it because that'll get 10 million views. That's it. Seems like there's one piece of content on our channel that just outperforms everything. Not even close.

We're sitting there trying to figure out what is the magic secret sauce for Us. And for what I like to do, we have not been able to crack the puzzle.

We do know that when I have a marker in my hand, there's a whiteboard and there's a gnarly person in the audience, those tend to do really well.

And because we're hitting on emotions and they're seeing how someone, me responds in real time to someone who's not going to just roll over and they say, popcorn ready?

And so when I'm out in the real world and I'm doing talks and workshops, whenever someone starts to argue with me, like team, team, get the camera on them. I feel viral video coming up. And then all of a sudden they shut down. I'm like, fudge me. Oh man, now it's not going to happen.

Because they know what's going to happen in some of them, God bless them, they'll say, I know, I still want to argue with you. I'm like, you know how this ends. For every person who does this, you don't look like a superstar. Would you like to proceed? Like, yes, like, love you.

Let's go. So we need to be out in the real world doing that kind of stuff.

Sean Cannell

01:02:42.118 - 01:02:58.248

I saw a short that you had and I'm curious if this would apply. You referenced David Baker's book the Business of Expertise, and there's a concept called drop and give me 20. Can that relate to creators?

They want to stand out in a competitive world. Can that be helpful?

Chris Do

01:02:58.344 - 01:03:01.832

Yeah. You know the thing about that idea from have you read that book, by the way?

Sean Cannell

01:03:01.856 - 01:03:02.232

I have not.

Chris Do

01:03:02.256 - 01:04:17.430

Okay, perfect. I'll give you a little context for that. His whole thing is people will say, I have no expertise, I can't write any articles.

And he says, in the military, to test your preparedness, they say, drop and give me 20. You should be able to do 20 push ups at any given time unless you're not fit enough to be in the military. That's a concept.

So he's like saying, you know what? Right now, drop and give me 20 nuggets about what you know, it takes the preciousness away from like what is the most important.

Just give me 20 things right now. So that's just a prompt to get you to like not be like a perfectionist monster. And like, oh, okay, okay, you could do this.

And the surprising thing is, and it's, it's going to be true for a lot of people. You're going to say, this is dumb. No one's going to care. This is super low value. When in truth it is not. Dumb.

A lot of people will care, and it will be valuable for lots of people. It's because there's a cognitive bias. It's called the curse of knowledge, that we tend to forget how hard it was for us at the beginning.

And it's so easy for us today that we think, no one can possibly not know this right now, but you could probably tell me something about our stats. I'm like, oh, yeah, I don't know that. You're like, dude, that is so 101. And I'll be like, oh, my God, Sean's a genius.

Sean Cannell

01:04:17.930 - 01:04:47.978

So what you would encourage the listeners, they're a content creator. Write out 20 topics, 20 ideas, 20 things you know about your channel topic, and turn that into content.

Would you say if it's an answer to a question, one question, one video, how would you package the distribution of content? Whole groups of subject matter, one question, one video. If you're saying long form, it'd probably be a little bit more robust.

How do you think about slicing and dicing information and packaging it in a good way?

Chris Do

01:04:48.114 - 01:07:10.250

That answer is going to depend. If you're a newbie creator or you're Alex Hermosi, it's going to be very different.

Let's assume you're relatively new because you're like, I need to get my sea legs under me. I would say one question, one answer per video. Because the title of the video is going to be much easier. You're going to make it more searchable.

And that's really kind of an important part to drive traffic to your channel. When you talk about multiple topics, it's like, what are you going to call it? You're going to call it A or call B.

And this is where it becomes very confusing. I don't know. So if you call it B, which is the second part of the video, everybody's turning like, what? I'm not getting into this at all.

This is clickbait. They might bounce. And you're going to get punished for it. You call it A.

As soon as they get that part, they'll leave and they're like, well, that's the problem. Let's say you do this enough now, where you feel like you can talk about multiple topics because they build on a bigger idea.

This is probably the Hormozi technique, which is I got a big idea. It requires a couple of steps for me to explain. But he's very good.

He's gifted at teaching people complex concepts very simply, and he takes all the academia language out so you can Just understand. And that's genius of what he does.

Everybody here can do that, but you have to practice and you have to do this in front of real people so you can see them responding to it because you're like, oh, I lost you there, didn't I? Okay, let me fix that part. So the way I do my whiteboard, long form content is this. I'll tell you the formula right now.

I have some young people who work for me having to be these two guys. I said, what is it that you want to learn that the people from our channel haven't figured out yet? Like, what about this?

So we write a bunch of topics. So of all these topics, which one do you think we should address first? Prioritize that one. Okay, give me two seconds. Okay, let me explain to you.

I would just freestyle the whole thing and I would see what parts were easy, what parts that got stuck, and then we're done. I would say, I'll see you guys tomorrow. We'll record this video. They send me the screenshot of that board. I go home and build a keynote deck.

I build in the dialogue so we're able to condense something that took two hours to work through into 45 minutes. And then we try to make it interactive. We invite our friends from Zoom to join us live.

And so as I'm explaining it, they can raise questions and we can interact with them. So I get a little bit of the audience part and the interaction and feedback. But the audience doesn't have to sit through a painful.

Like Chris is still working out the problem part. That form has worked really well for us. Those videos typically do over 2 or 300,000 views. Some of them have surpassed a million views.

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Sean Cannell

01:07:10.410 - 01:07:30.228

And so that's what you do on 45 or longer minute videos. That was the workflow to figure out the concept.

Your team, people on Zoom help you process it all, you synthesize it, make sure that it's going to be valuable into a deck. And then when you present that, do you present it live or is that an edited YouTube video?

Chris Do

01:07:30.364 - 01:08:32.918

Oftentimes it's live. We live stream the whole thing. I've seen you do this too. And they tend to work.

If you promote it enough in advance, tune in on this day, I'm going to do this. And then they'll tune in.

If you're a good teacher, if you're a good communicator and you bring like one ounce of charisma, people will stick there because you're giving them a free lesson. And the intention is to teach them. So if you're good at it, they will tune in.

To this date, our highest viewed live stream, which was, I think I want to say, like 1500 or 1700 people, I can't remember. And it beat the one with Aaron Draplin was me teaching people about typography. Super, relatively boring stuff.

But I said, each week I'm going to add a lesson, and if you don't watch it live, it disappears in 24 hours and you have to buy it. So every week, the audience kept growing and growing. So by the third week, they're like, this is good. We're learning. I'm going to bring the goods.

And that's what I did. So if you want to do that and develop a cadence where you can maintain that, unfortunately, it does a lot of work, as you know.

It's like I worked on it for like a whole day to get ready for, like an hour live stream.

Sean Cannell

01:08:33.004 - 01:08:37.698

Yep. I do the same. And it helps. And teaching off a deck helps you live stream better?

Chris Do

01:08:37.754 - 01:08:38.082

Yes.

Sean Cannell

01:08:38.146 - 01:08:43.730

Yeah, it helps you have your thoughts organized. It's for the audience sake. You mentioned earlier, have you ever done.

Chris Do

01:08:43.770 - 01:08:45.650

Like, a whiteboard version of your deck?

Sean Cannell

01:08:45.730 - 01:08:51.538

We did a king flip, which is a paper whiteboard, but yes, we've done that. I would love to do more. I want to start.

Chris Do

01:08:51.594 - 01:08:52.706

How did that perform for you?

Sean Cannell

01:08:52.778 - 01:09:09.877

Great. And I want to start a show called Framework Friday and do frameworks on Friday on a whiteboard.

I don't think I have 52 frameworks, so I don't think it would go all year, but it could be here and there every once in a while. And it doesn't need to be on a Friday. But, you know freestyle rap, I'm trying to just. It sounds cool.

Chris Do

01:09:09.933 - 01:09:11.089

Yeah, I like it.

Sean Cannell

01:09:11.469 - 01:09:30.784

As we land the plane, you did mention, if you're just starting out or if you're professional like Alex or Mosey, you should adapt the kind of content you're creating, understand where you are, and then level up. What is the difference between professionals and amateurs? And how can we level up our game this year?

Chris Do

01:09:30.872 - 01:09:34.560

Excuse me? Professional teachers or professional what? In general?

Sean Cannell

01:09:34.680 - 01:09:44.384

I don't know.

I saw one of your YouTube shorts that said professionals versus amateurs, and I'm trying to rehack your own viral content by pulling clips out of this video.

Chris Do

01:09:44.472 - 01:12:13.712

Yeah, you genius, you. Well, if we just like, what's the difference between professionals and amateurs? By the definition, professional does it for a living.

An amateur is a hobbyist enthusiast. Right. But I think the viral content comes into an amateur does something once and says, I'm good.

A professional does it over and over again until they get really, really good. Those are some of the differences. I think if we look at, say, Seth Godin's the Dip, right?

And the dip is a pretty simple concept, would probably be one of your framework Fridays, by the way, that whenever we start out something, if we look at the graph this on this axis, it's like time and energy on this results. So at the very beginning we do something.

We're playing basketball, we're making a YouTube video, we put very little time and energy into an effort and then we get some result. I got 100 new followers or I got a thousand views. Pretty awesome.

We keep doing that and then all of a sudden it peaks and it starts to go down in the negative direction and like, wait a minute, what's going on? How come I can't get the same success now? I'm working really hard and I'm just chasing the dragon, if you will, is like, I can't get back there.

And then we get into the valley, AKA the dip, and it's just a lot of work and not a lot of reward. And we're like, I just, I'm not made for this stuff. And most people quit. The valley of the dip is where all the quitters live and die.

There's a lot of graves, there's a lot of bodies there. Seth's thing is when you make a commitment to be good at something, you're not allowed to quit.

You have to just work your way through the dip because on the other side of dip, it's this massive return. And you and I know this from every creator that we've looked up to. They went through this. They call it consistency, but it's not consistency.

It's the fact that you're not willing to quit and you're making incremental improvements until you figure it out. So you got to play the game long enough until you get good.

So what Seth goes on to talk about, all right, is that you want things that you want to be difficult to attain, because difficult things to attain are valuable because they're scarce and rare. So if everybody was a great, charismatic, long form teacher on YouTube, I'm out of a job. I really am. Because it's like, everybody can do this.

I'm going to go back to breakdancing or something. I don't do that, by the way. And so we want to love that there's a dip.

We have to have the fortitude to get through it so that we can be good at something. It's true about every single thing. Unless you're some kind of savant, you got God born talent or whatever it is, you got to work through it.

And so instead of grimacing through the dip, we should embrace it and say this was expected. The rewards on the other side. I'm going to go through it.

Sean Cannell

01:12:13.816 - 01:12:26.402

On the other side of the dip is mastery. One of our core values at our company is the pursuit of mastery. You're a master. What's your definition of mastery?

Chris Do

01:12:26.546 - 01:13:43.862

That's a good question. I don't have a great answer for you, but I'll throw it out there.

When you can do something without great effort, I think you've achieved a level of mastery. You know those chefs that cut down vegetables like that, I'm like, that's mastery. In terms of like knife work, I get that.

When you have to stop measuring the ingredients and you can put together a beautiful dish, that's mastery.

When you can pull up a canvas and just start putting things on and then emotional, profound portrait you've ever seen just materializes out of nothing. That's mastery.

There's this one gentleman, I believe he's in China somewhere, in some province somewhere, and he's sitting there minding his own business. The setup is exactly the same every single time. Somebody walks up to him and shoves something in front of him and he goes, oh, okay.

And it might be like a green comb or something. Okay. Then he takes a little bit of this paint, a little bit of that paint, and a little bit of this paint, and he just. No measurement, no nothing.

Just by eyeballing it, he looks in the light, he mixes it up. They put in his can, and then he spray paints. He spray paints on something. It is a color match 100% of the time.

Some guy who's like, I don't even where he's wearing shoes and there's a stray random dog on the street, and he's just. He's like, the Home Depot color matching bear system. Yeah. But a human. Have you seen this video? Do you understand what I'm saying here?

Sean Cannell

01:13:43.886 - 01:13:45.110

That's insane. That's wild.

Chris Do

01:13:45.190 - 01:13:54.180

So what happens is people in these provinces, their thing gets damaged something, and they need an exact color match. Where are they going to go? They can go to the Chinese master.

Sean Cannell

01:13:54.260 - 01:13:54.884

Yeah.

Chris Do

01:13:55.012 - 01:13:59.892

And it's ridiculous because if you ever try to color match even metallic colors.

Sean Cannell

01:13:59.956 - 01:14:02.932

Home Depot doesn't get it right. Lowe's is going to fail with like.

Chris Do

01:14:03.036 - 01:14:19.986

25, 000 worth of laser equipment. They fail and he gets it right. Now, maybe he doesn't get right every once in a while and they throw that video away.

But my God, if you ever search this guy, you're going to see it is ridiculous how good he is. So I think there's a sense of effortlessness that happens when you achieve a love of mastery.

Sean Cannell

01:14:20.098 - 01:14:29.570

John Maxwell wrote a book called Good Leaders Ask Great Questions. What do you think the importance of questions is, and what questions do you think content creators should be asking?

Chris Do

01:14:29.730 - 01:15:49.438

I think in a society where we're trained to prize answers, questions are the undervalued thing that if you learn how to ask great questions, especially in this age of AI, to bring it full circle, it's the big unlock in life. I'm more impressed with people who know how to direct the machine by asking it the right questions and directing it than I am in the result itself.

I didn't even think that there were levels of prompting that some of these people are doing that. Like, clearly, I don't understand this game.

So whenever I'm talking to a client in any kind of situation or prospect, I should say, I've learned this thing from my former business mentor. He's passed away. I used to think it was about me demonstrating my knowledge or my mastery by giving them answers, suggestions, and advice.

The way I demonstrate my mastery is to ask them questions, to help them reveal the answer to themselves, to get the clarity. I've also learned that in life, very rarely do people like ideas that are so new and challenging, that are not their own.

But if you ask the right questions, they'll come to that new, challenging idea that they feel they have ownership over, and they will give you all the credit for coming up with the idea. And if you just learn to ask questions, because asking great questions is a 21st century skill that's undervalued right now.

Sean Cannell

01:15:49.574 - 01:16:00.654

As we land the plane, what should be on my 2024 reading list or audible listen list if I want to grow and succeed as a content creator?

Chris Do

01:16:00.782 - 01:16:08.170

Are we really landing the plane on this one? You're killing me on this last question here. That's a tough one. Sean, what would you say it is?

Sean Cannell

01:16:08.470 - 01:16:10.590

You can open up your audible if you have your phone on.

Chris Do

01:16:10.630 - 01:16:11.630

I don't do audible.

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Sean Cannell

01:16:11.790 - 01:16:13.454

You don't do any audiobooks?

Chris Do

01:16:13.582 - 01:16:40.020

I can't learn from them. I'm mostly a visual processor. If you use words, I won't know how to pronounce the word unless I see the word.

I didn't know this about myself for a long time. You say Something that I would mispronounce it later. Like, that's not the word. Dude, are you an idiot? I'm like, I heard Sean say it.

And until I see how it's spelled, I. I can't remember it. I've tried listening to audiobooks, like an hour, two hours go by. I'm like, I don't know a single thing that it said.

So I need to read the book.

Sean Cannell

01:16:40.320 - 01:16:47.048

Well, if we riff on books that I think are related to content creation, at the top of the list is YouTube Secret 2nd Edition.

Chris Do

01:16:47.144 - 01:16:55.930

I was going to say that if you let me say it. Start over. I will tell. I was going to say it, but I'm like, where are we going of this? And. And that's the only book, the Art of Humility too.

Sean Cannell

01:16:57.510 - 01:17:01.690

And. And the list is over. So actually I. That was. It was a trick question 101.

Chris Do

01:17:02.710 - 01:17:06.462

I'm like, I don't know. It's right in front of me. YouTube secrets everywhere we were planting it.

Sean Cannell

01:17:06.486 - 01:17:07.310

There was a plant.

Chris Do

01:17:07.390 - 01:17:12.958

I was like, you. You did what is that called? A mentalist trick on me. I'm like, is that the secrets?

Sean Cannell

01:17:13.054 - 01:18:22.712

Initially, I need to train for more mastery in Jedi Mind Trace and go visit Yoda because it was over there. Didn't work work. But yeah, but no, I mean legitimately. I think YouTube secrets. That's correct. Shout out to Daryl eaves.

I think YouTube formula is phenomenal as well. Pat Flynn, Super Fans is great. I think Russell Brunson Expert Secrets is a good read for expert industry, kind of personal brand. Those are a few.

And then I would often ask what specific skills? Because if we veer off into. Do you need to start selling? Do you want to learn how to get into some particular skill?

You're going to package coaching program or an online course or something. How do you sell it? And there could be some niche learnings there. And then of course, if you need to build a team or something.

So that would be a leadership direction. Or Brian Tracy, how to delegate would be an old. Maybe there's better new ones. Dan Martell, Buy back your time.

If you're just trying to get productivity but keeping it in the lane of maybe the business, the online business, packaging your expertise. You can mention that one again. I think about YouTube creators and content creators. Any books that come to mind.

Chris Do

01:18:22.816 - 01:21:25.026

That's a good, really good list. I would start with the number one book on that list, which is YouTube secrets. Let's put that aside. I'll take a totally different approach to this.

Something that we discussed somewhere else.

But I think if you want to create content, you need to work on the skill of teaching because that's really what you're doing, unless you're doing an entertainment thing. So if you're doing an entertainment thing, you're asking the wrong guy, because I'm not that guy. So let's look at pedagogy and things about teaching.

So there's a book, it's called 50 Strategies to Boost Cognitive Engagement. That's not a book normal people pick up. And it really breaks down the differences between traditional education and effective education.

And it goes down line by line. It's quite brilliant. And at least now we have a foundation to understand. Like we don't want to repeat the sins of our parents.

We want to look towards the future. And so I would start there. I already mentioned how to tell a story and stories that stick because now we understand how to teach.

But teaching based on facts is not engaging for anybody. Teaching through stories is.

And so if we say then we need to learn from the world of like the Pixars and the Disney's of the world who are masterful storytellers. There's this book, I believe it's called Directing a Story. And if that's incorrect, I'll send you the proper link.

It's called Directing a Story and it shows how to storyboard an entire film. It's fascinating how they break it down. So there's ideas and then there are images that storyboards that go with it.

And you're like, I'm really into the story right now. And it's masterfully done.

And so if you study anywhere where you think there's a masterful storyteller, you should just copy them as much as possible and then you'll be able to transform it into your own style. I also love to watch standup comics, and in particular I watch their stage presence, the delivery, the intonation, their timing.

But I really appreciate crowd work too. That aligns more with my style of teaching and talking because you have to be quick on your feet.

And when they turn a phrase or they pull something from nothing, it's a match trick for the audience. And it's something that's going to be captivating for everybody who's there.

I fell in love with the band 20 One Pilots because I think his name is Tyler Joseph. I saw a random clip on YouTube where he's like, he's on a piano with a laptop and there's a darkened room somewhere, a small, very, very small venue.

He goes, I'd like to perform some songs for you. And I'm just gonna do it all by myself. Is that okay? And so he has two or three different mics. Cause there's different vocal processing he does.

And he starts playing piano. He goes, okay, that's pretty good. And he builds a song in front of us in real time, a song that he's performed before.

But in the nature of him doing it, it's like a very unique version of it. And I was like, this guy is so talented.

And then I started looking in the back catalog and realized Blurry Face and all these other songs I was listening to was from the same band. Anytime you have mastery or expertise that you can demonstrate in real time, that's how we know you know what you're doing.

Sean Cannell

01:21:25.178 - 01:21:35.810

Those are some great recommendations. And of course, we'll put a full list of resources, including at the end when we share your resources. But a question on reading. Do you read fiction?

Chris Do

01:21:35.970 - 01:21:38.258

I don't. Not anymore. I used to love fiction.

Sean Cannell

01:21:38.354 - 01:21:39.090

What kind?

Chris Do

01:21:39.210 - 01:21:40.630

Science fiction, mostly.

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Sean Cannell

01:21:41.060 - 01:21:47.916

Did you learn from it as related to business or was it more for entertainment and relaxation?

Chris Do

01:21:48.108 - 01:22:19.012

I think it's for, like, changing my worldview. I'm a big Isaac Asimov fan. So long before Foundation, I read foundation, the series. I read iRobot. I also love Dune, Frank Herbert.

So I'm just into world building and there's something that's really interesting and science fiction intrigues me because it's. It could be real. Just we don't have the explanation on how to scientifically prove it just yet. And so I love that.

I also love Edgar Allen poems, like some. Some dark gothic stuff.

Sean Cannell

01:22:19.076 - 01:22:20.948

You're a fan of the new Dune movie?

Chris Do

01:22:21.044 - 01:22:36.956

I was a fan of the original, which puts me in a minority because people just hated on David Lynch's version. Even David lynch doesn't like his movie, but I loved his film. I am also a fan of the new movie.

And it's killing me that the movie was delayed in terms of its second release.

Sean Cannell

01:22:37.108 - 01:22:55.084

Final question. There's a song called Forever Young. What is your secret to the Fountain of Youth? Are you starting a side skincare company?

Do you have a skincare routine? And for anybody that wants to not age like you, what are your tips?

Chris Do

01:22:55.212 - 01:22:56.844

I'm going to do a joke on stage.

Sean Cannell

01:22:56.972 - 01:22:57.420

Yeah.

Chris Do

01:22:57.500 - 01:23:24.012

I said I'm here to teach you about sales and marketing content creation. But I really know what you're here for.

I'm 51 years old and you want to know what my skincare regime is, and I'm going to tell you But I'm going to tell you all these things, and it's not going to matter to you, because the most important thing is to be Asian, because it was an expression. Right. Asian don't raisin. And then there's like, black don't crack. And Latin always sat. And then I say white. Good night. I don't know what to do.

Sean Cannell

01:23:24.036 - 01:23:26.156

I appreciate it. I mean, that's struggle is real.

Chris Do

01:23:26.228 - 01:23:28.388

Moisturizer. Yeah, mostly just moisturizer.

Sean Cannell

01:23:28.404 - 01:23:29.252

Just moisturizer?

Chris Do

01:23:29.316 - 01:23:30.772

Mostly. Yeah, Daily for you?

Sean Cannell

01:23:30.876 - 01:23:31.508

Oh, for me?

Chris Do

01:23:31.564 - 01:23:32.068

Yeah, for you.

Sean Cannell

01:23:32.124 - 01:23:32.836

You're giving me advice?

Chris Do

01:23:32.868 - 01:23:33.172

No, no.

Sean Cannell

01:23:33.196 - 01:23:34.180

I mean, I need it.

Chris Do

01:23:34.220 - 01:23:37.140

I know. Because. Because white folk have drier skin.

Sean Cannell

01:23:37.220 - 01:23:37.812

Yeah.

Chris Do

01:23:37.956 - 01:23:46.820

And Asian folk have oilier skin. So it has its good and bad. I'm always shiny, but I'm not drying out, especially out here in the desert. Isn't your skin, like, super dry?

Sean Cannell

01:23:46.900 - 01:23:51.812

I try to drink water. I just started getting into, like, Kiehl's skin stuff. I just turned 40.

Chris Do

01:23:51.916 - 01:23:52.276

Okay.

Sean Cannell

01:23:52.308 - 01:23:52.580

You know.

Chris Do

01:23:52.620 - 01:23:53.172

Okay. Very good.

Sean Cannell

01:23:53.196 - 01:23:54.482

Yeah, we're doing my best.

Chris Do

01:23:54.596 - 01:23:58.758

Okay. So I'll get real with you. Okay. Two straight guys talking about skin care.

Sean Cannell

01:23:58.814 - 01:23:59.190

Yeah.

Chris Do

01:23:59.270 - 01:24:27.296

Okay. So the first thing is just you want to have clean skin. So you usually wash your face in the morning, at night, and all soaps will clean your skin.

The more expensive ones will not dry out your skin. So you just want to clean your skin. You want to exfoliate just a little bit, and then you need to moisturize.

Like, for me, this part of my mouth gets really dry and cracked. Right. So you need to moisturize differently here than everywhere else. And then it's like a sunblock. You wear sunblock?

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Sean Cannell

01:24:27.488 - 01:24:28.032

No.

Chris Do

01:24:28.136 - 01:24:50.506

Oh, it's going to be a problem because the age spots and the melanin and all that kind of stuff. So you want to wear some sunblock and sunblock. Again, the cheap kind will protect you, but it's greasy, it's oily, and make you look really shiny.

Not very flattering for camera. So you just want to buy, like, La Roche Posay or something like. Like that. It's super expensive, but it. It comes on like milk.

Like, you want to buy the milk kind.

Sean Cannell

01:24:50.658 - 01:25:00.554

My secret was I grew up in Seattle for the first 27. 27 years of my life. So it was no sun, so it kind of saved the sunblock piece. But now a little bit of Vegas.

Chris Do

01:25:00.602 - 01:25:01.594

You can get a lot of sun.

Sean Cannell

01:25:01.682 - 01:25:15.780

Yeah. We're kind of going back to Seattle. Majority. But those are some. It's probably the most important part of the podcast was this. This information.

So Chris, do you got a book pocket full of dough?

Chris Do

01:25:15.860 - 01:25:16.452

Yes.

Sean Cannell

01:25:16.596 - 01:25:23.156

And we'll link that one up. And what are you doing? What do you want to shout out? What should be in the show notes?

Chris Do

01:25:23.268 - 01:26:52.392

Okay, I'm going to be selfish. I'm going to ask for two things right now. Number one, I have a coaching community.

If you're a creative entrepreneur and you feel like it's a very lonely endeavor and you just need people to be around you to help support you and to know that people struggle and they have solutions and you find community something that's exciting, consider joining the Future Pro group.

And if you're at a place where you're doing a million dollars more and you're creating content and you feel like you've hit a certain plateau, I have a program called Brand Lab. It's going to open up in April of next year. We're doing our pilot season. It's 10 entrepreneurs right now. Neil's one of them and they're just amazing.

I've never had people in a coaching group or students. I don't want to call them students because they're successful entrepreneurs that are such go getters. It's incredible.

Like, I say something and I forgot what they were supposed to do and next week they come back. Don't you want to review this? I'm like, I've never seen this before. Like, you actually do the things I asked you to do. It's incredible.

So what we do is we do a lot of whiteboard road mapping and figuring out things and then hopefully we're getting to this point where they can show me what they're doing and I could give them very specific feedback on how to make it better. I believe that's one of my skills. I'm a really critical, observant person. I just need to get paid for it.

So I'm like, okay, if you change this and try this and do this instead, let's measure that versus what you're doing now. So I'm very excited about that.

Sean Cannell

01:26:52.496 - 01:27:45.328

Brilliant. So those two programs will link up. Number three, I'll add to the list.

If you're on YouTube, I would love to hear your aha moment or your greatest takeaway from this episode. And then of course, on the audio plat platforms, rate and review. And always love and super grateful for those reviews. On Apple in particular.

It really helps spread the word on this podcast and share it with somebody. It's an honor to get to sit across from you talking to a master and dropping so much wisdom. Christo, thank you for coming back.

And number four, there's the past conversations that we've had on your channel and on your podcast.

One of my favorites was an almost two hour conversation about lessons from grow a video live and spending almost a million dollars and all the different crazy things. Yeah, that episode was a classic. And that's on your show. That can be in the show notes as well as a couple other conversations if anybody wants more.

Chris Do

01:27:45.384 - 01:29:00.160

Chris, do Sean, can I say something, please? I know that was the end of the episode, but somebody shared this idea with me. Actually, it was Scott Galloway.

Didn't share it with me, shared it with everybody. He's like the metaverse. You remember that hype and how meta's dumping a ton of money into this losing proposition?

He goes, the metaverse already happens. Except for it doesn't happen here, it happens here. He says podcasts, think about it.

Most people listen to podcasts while they're doing other things, so they're experiencing simultaneous realities at the same time. So they're driving, they're washing the dishes, or they're doing something while they're listening to you.

Don't underestimate the mind space that you have. This is very powerful real estate up here. So podcast. This is why I'm like going to double down on my podcast.

It's a, a really different relationship with the audience because you're literally in their head and it's a profound thing.

So podcasts like this, you're going to develop such a deep relationship with that person that when they see you in real life, they're going to like, you've been in my head, in my bed, on the lawn, this whole time. And I know that sounds really creepy, but it's, you know, it's platonic.

I believe that they're saying that, but, you know, they're experiencing you on another level and it's, it's a profound responsibility.

Sean Cannell

01:29:00.240 - 01:29:25.240

Now, bro, you've been in my head, in my bed, on the lawn, on the tread. On the tread. Yeah, it turns out the freestyle rap thing, that was the context that actually packaged this all up.

But saying that as the plate is officially landed. Massive love and gratitude to Think Media podcast community for hanging out with us today, Chris.

Thank you so much and we will see you in a future episode.

Rebecca

01:29:31.340 - 01:30:15.490

Thanks for joining us. If you haven't already, subscribe to our show on your favorite podcasting app and get new insightful episodes from us every week.

The Future podcast is hosted by Chris Doe and produced and edited by Rich Cardona Media. Thank you to Adam Sanborn for our intro music. If you enjoyed this episode, then do us a favor by reviewing and rating our show on Apple Podcasts.

It will help us grow the show and make future episodes that much better.

If you'd like to support the show and invest in yourself while you're at it, visit thefuture.com and you'll find video courses, digital products, and a bunch of helpful resources about design and the creative business. Thanks again for listening and we'll see you next time.

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